Hello all I've been fighting the urge to start experimenting with cut bait for some time now and I'm starting to cave. I know that cut bait is a major deal over on Lake Ontario so I thought some of you might share your knowledge on the subject. How do you rig it that works for you? Twinkies or no? What bait head? Lead lengths? Anything else you might care to pass along would be much appreciated. I know some say you have to commit to bait exclusively and others mix it right in with their spoon/plug/attractor-fly spread. Thank you in advance!
Jim...I Fish Therefore I Am
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Jim, An A-Tom-Mik twinkie behind an Oki slasher (11"fish) is a great place to start some favorites are Blue Angel with blue three fly. Golden Boy with Red three fly. Frog/Kermit with Green Glow three Fly. I run almost all twinkies when I run meat. You do not have to run it exclusivly just don't crowd the area that your running the meat in. Add other presentations on dipseys, thumpers, core, etc. I've also been running some whole alwives this past season with success.
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Jim, I attended the seminar given by Jerry Bechtold at the Birch Run show and he convinced me (along with others over the last couple years) that I should be in the game. I will be joining you this year as a beginner. Bechtold did not push any single method but rather the importance of just having it out. He was adamant about using whole fish though. The method of preparing the herring on the west coast is superior to that used by producers here according to him. I suspect that you can get more information on rigging methods on his website. His Michigan distributor for whole herring is Great Lakes Tackle in Benton Harbor-Rex Schuman 269 208 1527 I believe he will ship directly to you or give you a local source that he sells to. PM me if you have any questions I may be able to answer about his presentation and keep all of us informed of your success during the summer!
I'll probably keep thinking of things to add to this...Bechtold also said to leave the eyes of the herring visible. His harness setup has a clamping "head" that allows you to do this. He says to always rig the herring straight (no bends or curves in the body) His clamping "head" has fins on it so you can run it clean and it will spin in a circle or you can run it with a flasher. Again he did not really push any single method of presentation.
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Although I have only 2 years experence running bait, I'd have to agree with Popeye. After many trials and errors I've found the best set-up (for me) is to run the large fish shaped flashers with the 3 fly rigs and strip bait. About the only difference is the colors I have the best luck with in Lake Michigan. A black momba with a clear/red three fly rig is a constant producer, all season long, when I'm running any other color I try and match the flasher to the fly colors - yellow tail flasher/green rig, green/green or frog, blue/blue. I haven't found a color that won't produce some of the time but these are my main color set-ups for both riggers and divers. When I run it its all I'll put down and I'll only run 4 rods ran pretty tight together. Just my way. Dave
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Dave S. Have you run whole herring along with cut strips? Wondering if the catch rate is more, less or the same. As I said in my post Bechtold was pretty well fixed on using whole herring and making sure the eyes were exposed. Also who's flasher and teasers do you use? Thanks for the input. Mike.
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My basic set up is running 4 rods, 2 riggers, 2 divers, ran pretty close together. Great Lakes Angler ask me to write an article on the method I use and it was ran in the July/Aug. issue last year in the basics & beyond section. I can't take credit for the quality writing, this was done by Dave Mull, he ask questions, I answered - after about 10 emails he came up with the article and he done a great job of putting into words and artwork my program. The three fly rigs I used last year were the Twinkies (that I would re-tie with a better line) and the A-tomic. The best flasher I've found is John Kings fish shaped flasher, it looks simular to the Kingfishers but his quality is much better. I have had sucess with the whole ran clean on a core out there all by its self as a tail gunner. As far as Mr. Becholds methods goes, I have ran his bait holder and it performs as well as any other out there right now, his is the only one I've seen that is short enough to expose the eyes, that may be the reason he said what he did about that. I will not knock another mans product (although I heard from more than one person he knocked mine) but maybe the reason he streeses whole bait is because of the fact he has only whole bait for sale. He makes one fine, fish producing flasher that has put many fish in my boat, but when I heard he was telling people that Fish-On products were rejects from the susi (sp) market in Japan, I lost all respect for him. I'm new here and like this board, I hope I didn't step on any toes with my post but I was ask and I tryed to answer the best I could - try different methods and see what works for you - I can tell you this method will make a in-experienced fisherman like myself look pertty good at the cleaning tables. If anyone has any other questions I am more than happy to share what I have learned over the past few years. Dave
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I must adomantly disagree with you. We ran your FishOn bait last year and it was far superior to any other cut bait or whole bait we ran. It held together tight and did not spoil on us. I don't know what it was but we were able to re-use your bait on several trips as long as we kept it cold. Thumbs up to you, and don't be afraid to toot your own horn!
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Jim, Sorry it took so long but here goes my thoughts and experiences with cut bait. I have run this for about 10 years now, I remember back when I first started I was using a leader approx. 1.5x's the lenght of the dodger. Thats right I was using the LJ silver prism fish school dodger. It worked real well, I put alot of fish in the boat. Now I have found that the fish are lazier and the biggest fish want a leader that is 48-60" long. I run ATOMIKS Twinkie rigs and I also make my own with RHYS DAVIS heads. I use 50lb test for a leader and you can use what ever hook you would like but I use a high qauilty treble. I agree with Werner in regaurds to the best flasher has to be the fish shaped flasher. I have not had any luck with the SD,FC, or any of the smaller rotating flashers. I use the kingfishers and I also use reagular11" Dodgers in a host of colors. Mostly GlowGreen in the early morning to a silver of somesort later if it is bright out. I have not experimented with the whole bait but a friend of mine uses whole Alewives that he gets off his dock and he kills the kings with it. Hope this helps, and don't get discouraged it may take a time or two to get it to work for you but it is a great tool. Good luck Rich
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hey well heres my 2 cents i fish lake ontario and to me the most important thing to do is to make sure your cutbait is makeing the proper turns .i have found that it doesn't matter as much on color of flasher or head if the strip is not turning correctly i have found that for me its about one and ahalf turns per second give or take if its not turning bend the head tab just a littleif it turning to fast straighten it out a littlealso if you can run 2 hooks one in the meat the other as a short trailer.once you get the right combo you'll know real quick good luck julius
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